Info TSMC, Samsung and IFS's Quarterly Financial Reports

Markfw · Feb 11, 2024

Tigerick said:
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money.udn.com

Here is the source, yeah AMD is not listed. Anyhow the information is for this year, AMD should have more tape out for 3nm which contribute more. N4P is relatively cheaper, maybe that's why...

Maybe its lost in the chinese to english translation, as its not there either. In fact look here: They are 3rd.

(link https://exploresemis.substack.com/p/tsmcs-top-10203040-customers-who)

Tigerick · Feb 11, 2024

Markfw said:
Maybe its lost in the chinese to english translation, as its not there either. In fact look here: They are 3rd.

(link https://exploresemis.substack.com/p/tsmcs-top-10203040-customers-who)

View attachment 93679

Yeah, I have reread the article, it seems to list top 6 OEMs for 3nm revenue, then it is making sense. Anyhow it is unofficial list, do you have list for 2023?

PS: I have removed top 6 list due to different context.

Markfw · Feb 11, 2024

Tigerick said:
Yeah, I have reread the article, it seems to list top 6 OEMs for 3nm revenue, then it is making sense. Anyhow it is unofficial list, do you have list for 2023?

PS: I have removed top 6 list due to different context.

Google listed that one, I did not look down the list further.

Tigerick · Mar 18, 2024

	2023	2024	2025	2026	2027	2028
IFS	Intel 3	Intel 18A
Density	143	195

Samsung	SF3E	SF3	SF2	SF2P	1.4 nm
Density	159	178	187	198	243
Perf / Power	6.56	7.79	9.62	10.55

TSMC	N3B	N3E	N2	N2P		14A
Density	283	273	313	349		392
Perf / Power	9.3	10.26	16.92

TechInsights has presented their comparison table between IFS, SF and TSMC at 2024 SEMI International Strategy Symposium. IFS's process density as suspected is pretty low, that's why they don't win any major contract. I have calculated performance/power at the table above.

N3B's density is in fact denser than upcoming N3E due to multi-patterning solution. And that's why Apple will continue using it for M4 series cause M4 Max will likely pass 100 billions transistor threshold.

Tigerick · Apr 4, 2024

https://www.reuters.com/technology/intel-discloses-financials-foundry-business-2024-04-02/

During a presentation for investors, Chief Executive Pat Gelsinger said 2024 would be the year of worst operating losses for the company's chipmaking business and that it expects to break even on an operating basis by about 2027.

Here is the BS from Pat:

Gelsinger said the foundry business was weighed down by bad decisions, including one year ago against using extreme ultraviolet (EUV) machines from Dutch firm ASML. Partially as a result of the missteps, Intel has outsourced about 30% of the total number of wafers to external contract manufacturers such as TSMC, Gelsinger said. It aims to bring that number down to roughly 20%.

Anyhow, I have created a table to compare yearly revenue from 3 foundry. We should see how IF going to turn things around in 2030:-

	Intel Foundry	+/- Margin	Report Loss Business to TSMC's N3B	Samsung Foundry	Total IF + SF Revenue	TSMC's Advanced Process (N7 & Below)
2022	$27.49 billions	- $5.2 billions		$22.53 billions	$50 billions	$40.22 billions

2023	$18.9 billions	- $7 billions		$16.77 billions	$35.67 billions	$40.16 billions

2024		- -	- $4 billions

2025		- -	-$10 billions

2026		- -	NVL-S N2

2027		+

2028

2029

2030	> SF

Based on revenue figures of IFS in 2023 ($18.9 billions), IFS should overtake SF already which has earned $16.77 billions in 2023. The reason behind is Intel going to order N3B wafers from TSMC this year. There is report about Intel going to spend $4 billions this year and $10 billions next year for N3B wafers. That's mean this year IFS's revenue should drop sequentially...

It also means the worst year of Intel Foundry has not come yet...

H433x0n · Apr 4, 2024

Tigerick said:
View attachment 95493

2023 2024 2025 2026 2027 2028
IFS Intel 3 Intel 18A
Density 143 195
Samsung SF3E SF3 SF2 SF2P 1.4 nm
Density 159 178 187 198 243
Perf / Power 6.56 7.79 9.62 10.55
TSMC N3B N3E N2 N2P 14A
Density 283 273 313 349 392
Perf / Power 9.3 10.26 16.92

TechInsights has presented their comparison table between IFS, SF and TSMC at 2024 SEMI International Strategy Symposium. IFS's process density as suspected is pretty low, that's why they don't win any major contract. I have calculated performance/power at the table above.

N3B's density is in fact denser than upcoming N3E due to multi-patterning solution. And that's why Apple will continue using it for M4 series cause M4 Max will likely pass 100 billions transistor threshold.

This is comparing the theoretical max dense library. So it’s comparing 2-1-fin cells against a 3 fin cell. A more proper comparison would be comparing TSMC’s 2-2 fin cell library that they use as standard for HPC against Intel’s 3 fin library used in Intel 3. When using that metric TSMC is still considerably more dense 182.5mtr/mm2 vs 143mtr/mm2 but it’s comparing apples/apples. These are the cells that would be used in AMD processors and Nvidia GPUs.

Info TSMC, Samsung and IFS's Quarterly Financial Reports

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