Israel: We Are At War

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linkgoron

Platinum Member
Mar 9, 2005
2,576
1,231
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The ceasefire may extend as both Hamas and Israel appear interested in further exchanges.

The way Hamas has been delaying the deal today, I'm not sure that they have any real interest. They've already delayed by more than three hours. According to the agreement, they have until midnight (GMT+2), so around 5 hours left. I assume that the deal will go through today, but this doesn't bode well for making further exchanges.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,739
10,271
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The way Hamas has been delaying the deal today, I'm not sure that they have any real interest. They've already delayed by more than three hours. According to the agreement, they have until midnight (GMT+2), so around 5 hours left. I assume that the deal will go through today, but this doesn't bode well for making further exchanges.
Well, that was a post by K1052, but I'll open my yap anyway: That's the way "diplomacy" works, especially between committed enemies. While each side has an interest in making an exchange, each side will be making maximum demands on the other right up to the deadline, hoping the other side will blink first.

Since both sides seem to want this, I assume, from my seat in the bleachers, that it will get done in some form at some time soon . . . enough.
 

amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
4,300
2,632
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How duplicitous of a snake can one be to say this:

Netanyahu: “I have not seen yet the effort that I’d like to see from the UN and the international agencies to build shelters there [in Gaza]”

“Winter is coming and there is no reason not to erect tens of thousands of tents in the safe zone or next to the safe zone,” he said...


translation: we are appearing no less monstrous than Hamas on the world stage. Lets try to inject a bit of fake compassion here for any idiots out there who still take us seriously.

 
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KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
31,646
49,693
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One of the reasons they are trying to muzzle Haaretz, they tend to publish articles critical of Israel at times


~ Eiland, not a well man, who has even written a book about his suffering, has an idea: Epidemics in Gaza are good for Israel. “After all, severe epidemics in the southern Strip will bring victory closer and reduce fatalities among IDF soldiers,” he wrote this week in Yedioth Ahronoth. One only has to wait for the daughters of Hamas’ leaders to contract the plague, and we’ve won.

~ Eiland, in the role of Mother Theresa, an officer and a gentleman in the world’s most moral army, made a Nazi proposal and no storm broke out. Anyone who attributes genocide to Israel is anti-Semitic, after all.
 

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
31,646
49,693
136
Last i hear the ceasefire might be over


This was stated as the reason -

Hamas has decided to delay the release of the second batch of Israeli hostages until Israel complies with all the terms of the swap agreement.

1- two Palestinians were killed in Gaza, others injured when Israeli soldiers fired live ammunition at them. One of them was seen in a video bleeding on the floor, people couldn’t reach him to rescue him because of snipers’ fire targeting anyone approaching him

2- agreement said that Palestinian women and teens would be selected for release based on how long they had been in jail, something Israel did not do yesterday

3- aid trucks were prevented from reaching areas in northern Gaza

4- the no-fly zone was breached by Israel in South Gaza

5- Israel took tough measures to restrain the gathering of Palestinians receiving their loved-ones

6- Israel did not treat the liberated Palestinians well before releasing them

On the other hand, Hamas and other Palestinian factions complied with all terms agreed upon

-i have heard multiple reports of IOF warning civilians from going back to northern Gaza and trying to stop them, most simple just want to go home and know that Israel will just bomb them in the south, better to die in your own home than in a camp they said
 

amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
4,300
2,632
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Israeli journalist Gideon Levy:

3 principles that enable Israelis to live in peace with the occupation.

1. Most believe they are the chosen people, so they think they have the right to do whatever they want;
2. There were more brutal and longer occupations in history than the Israeli occupation, but there was nowhere where the occupier presented himself as not only the victim but the only victim;
3. and this is the most dangerous, is the systematic dehumanization of Palestinians, so you can do whatever you want with them.

 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,739
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After some mediating by Egypt between Israel and Hamas it seems tonight's swap was completed.

I'm SO surprised . . . not. Both sides wanted this. Last moment posturing and horse trading is a staple of any such negotiations between deeply opposed sides, be they between labor vs. management or the governments of different peoples. You can count on it.
 
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IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,001
32,245
136
How duplicitous of a snake can one be to say this:

Netanyahu: “I have not seen yet the effort that I’d like to see from the UN and the international agencies to build shelters there [in Gaza]”

“Winter is coming and there is no reason not to erect tens of thousands of tents in the safe zone or next to the safe zone,” he said...


translation: we are appearing no less monstrous than Hamas on the world stage. Lets try to inject a bit of fake compassion here for any idiots out there who still take us seriously.

Someone really should replace all these houses we are busy destroying.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,461
7,984
136
Preface: The link provided is only meant to inform others of something that I thought was interesting and germane to this thread topic that I wasn't previously aware of irt how the Palestinians and it's militant arm PLO affected the attitudes of its fellow Arab nations. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
4,300
2,632
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I think some of us may have seen this bit from Giora Eiland, former head of Israeli National Security council, who penned an op-ed in the Yedioth Ahronoth, a Hebrew paper where Israeli officials feel freer to express controversial matters than in the English press.

This bit may have been posted earlier...

“The international community warns us of a humanitarian disaster in Gaza and of severe epidemics. We must not shy away from this, as difficult as that may be. After all, severe epidemics in the south of the Gaza Strip will bring victory closer and reduce casualties among IDF soldiers.”

But the rest of it of is quite revealing in how Israeli leaders approach the overall conflict with the Palestinians in which they treat them all (combatants and civilians) as a homogeneous enemy. And that Israel should not give in to U.S. pressure with regard to the humanitarian aspects of the conflict.

 
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KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
31,646
49,693
136
Israeli journalist Gideon Levy:

3 principles that enable Israelis to live in peace with the occupation.

1. Most believe they are the chosen people, so they think they have the right to do whatever they want;
2. There were more brutal and longer occupations in history than the Israeli occupation, but there was nowhere where the occupier presented himself as not only the victim but the only victim;
3. and this is the most dangerous, is the systematic dehumanization of Palestinians, so you can do whatever you want with them.


He's had multiple threats to his life due to his writing, good interview with him
 

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
31,646
49,693
136
Without US AId the Israeli's cannot continue this




Israeli minister Benny Gantz demanded on Sunday that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu remove all political payouts from a proposed wartime budget, widening a potentially dangerous rift with religious nationalist parties in the government.
Under the coalition agreement Netanyahu struck with Smotrich and the heads of other religious parties after last year's election, billions of dollars are due to be set aside for ultra-Orthodox and far-right-wing pro-settler parties.

Gantz, in a strongly-worded letter to Netanyahu that his office made public, referred to a meeting of the broader cabinet scheduled for Monday that will deal with the proposed budget changes.

Gantz repeated his opposition to the inclusion of "coalition funds" in the proposed budget and said there should be no extra money for purposes beyond the war effort or supporting economic growth.

Should the meeting take place and the budget remain as is, Gantz said his faction would "vote against the proposed budget and weigh its next steps".


paying off the ultra-orthodox and exempting them from service is just mindblowing

(In 2020, the ultra-Orthodox population in Israel numbered approximately 1,175,000, representing 12.6% of the total population.)

 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
30,223
44,433
136
Without US AId the Israeli's cannot continue this

View attachment 89397


Israeli minister Benny Gantz demanded on Sunday that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu remove all political payouts from a proposed wartime budget, widening a potentially dangerous rift with religious nationalist parties in the government.
Under the coalition agreement Netanyahu struck with Smotrich and the heads of other religious parties after last year's election, billions of dollars are due to be set aside for ultra-Orthodox and far-right-wing pro-settler parties.

Gantz, in a strongly-worded letter to Netanyahu that his office made public, referred to a meeting of the broader cabinet scheduled for Monday that will deal with the proposed budget changes.

Gantz repeated his opposition to the inclusion of "coalition funds" in the proposed budget and said there should be no extra money for purposes beyond the war effort or supporting economic growth.

Should the meeting take place and the budget remain as is, Gantz said his faction would "vote against the proposed budget and weigh its next steps".


paying off the ultra-orthodox and exempting them from service is just mindblowing

(In 2020, the ultra-Orthodox population in Israel numbered approximately 1,175,000, representing 12.6% of the total population.)


Gantz, right again.

Subsidizing religious extremists is such bullshit. We have to do it in NY, they have to do it in Israel. Oh if everyone could just tell these ultra right holy roller assholes to fuck off and pay their own ways. I guess while I'm wishing, I'd like to see stipulations on foreign aid with cancel triggers to the effect of "Want military aid? Can't use it on civilians."

Either maintain an AFU level of military professionalism and respect for Geneva Conventions, or make your own JDAMs and SDBs.
 
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KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
31,646
49,693
136
Since October 7, Israeli attacks have killed at least 5,500 children, according to Palestinian officials. That is one Palestinian child killed every 10 minutes, or about one out of every 200 children in the Gaza Strip.

An additional 1,800 children are missing under the rubble, most of them presumed dead.


some updated numbers as they have been very hard to come by after IOF shut down the main hospital
 
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Ajay

Lifer
Jan 8, 2001
16,094
8,111
136
Interesting article from The Times saying Israel's not doing so well


Archived post below
Modern powerful military blunders into a one way dead end because of poor political decisions from the top. Sounds kind of familiar. Good article - thanks!
 
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SteveGrabowski

Diamond Member
Oct 20, 2014
8,594
7,214
136
Some Updates i saw:


Pope Francis calling it terrorism not sitting well with Israel


Israel threatens to shut down one of the main Israeli newspapers for not being 'Patriotic' enough....
Yeah hard to not see this as terrorism


another source: https://edition.cnn.com/2023/11/19/us/palestine-paterson-new-jersey-gaza/index.html
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
25,873
24,213
136
all you have to do is look at Bibi hanging out with long established anti-semite Musk - he doesnt' care about anything except support of their genocide and final oppression of Palestine, and in that, he knows he has an ally in Musk. Ultimately the far rights goal is to protect Israel regardless of how Nazi they get with the Palestinians, and Musk is a far right conspiracy theorist loon with literally no soul. If you are a Jew against the Palestinian genocide you are not really a Jew, but if you are actually an anti-Semite and supports our genocide against the Palestinians, you are good to go.

Israel has become Nazi Germany, only just a bit slower to catchup because there is more media now in modern times than there was back in the 1930's and 1940's. If they could get away with just loading up the Palestinians into gas chambers without all the attention our new technology gives media, they would be doing it right now.

The Israeli Jewish state have become Nazis.

You can't make this shit up or write it, it's just the human condition.
 
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