NV Super refresh reviews

Heartbreaker · Jan 31, 2024

blckgrffn said:
Truly a $200 price cut. I guess its still the fastest nvidia card for less than about $1800-$2,000. It's a big premium for a final but noticeable step up. Which is by design, and I am not taking a shot at nvidia here. That's just functional merchandising when you are in the position to do so. At least that final step the 4090 is measurable.

Yep, 4070 S is primarily a modest performance bump, 4070 Ti S is primarily a VRAM Bump, and 4080 S is primarily a price cut.

Refreshes like this obviously aren't aimed at being a big jump to sell to people that already have 4000 series cards. They are meant to improve competitive positioning (and generate more free marketing).

I'd say it's mostly mission accomplished, the S cards improve NVidia positioning against AMD, making it much harder to choose an AMD card.

I'm surprised AMD has done essentially nothing to react.

igor_kavinski · Jan 31, 2024

Heartbreaker said:
I'd say it's mostly mission accomplished, the S cards improve NVidia positioning against AMD, making it much harder to choose an AMD card.

I'm surprised AMD has done essentially nothing to react.

Yes. RIP AMD.

SMH

igor_kavinski · Jan 31, 2024

MSI GeForce RTX 4080 Super Expert Review

MSI introduces a new premium design in their "Expert" lineup, showcasing an impressive all-metal cooler that competes with the Founders Edition looks. Priced at $1150, it offers a triple-slot, dual-fan cooling solution, albeit on the high side cost-wise.

www.techpowerup.com

The ASUS cards win here. MSI doesn't look too good here.

AdamK47 · Jan 31, 2024

I'd buy a full AD102 4090 if Nvidia would just make one. 4090 Super, 4090 Ti, or whatever they would call it.

jpiniero · Jan 31, 2024

AdamK47 said:
I'd buy a full AD102 4090 if Nvidia would just make one. 4090 Super, 4090 Ti, or whatever they would call it.

May as well save your pennies for the $3k 5090 Tie.

yottabit · Jan 31, 2024

Well I abandoned my original plans to grab the 4080 Super and ended up ordering a 4070 Super FE for $599 after seeing them in stock at Nvidia last night. After speed-running reviews it seemed to be one of the better value Nvidia cards if you are OK with 12 GB VRAM. It'll be a huge upgrade from the 1070 in the wife's PC. I paid $409 for the 1070 in October 2016, $599 doesn't seem TOO bad in comparison

I'll be holding out for the next gen (or next-next-next gen) cards to replace my 3070 since I mostly game at 1080p anyway

blckgrffn · Jan 31, 2024

AdamK47 said:
I'd buy a full AD102 4090 if Nvidia would just make one. 4090 Super, 4090 Ti, or whatever they would call it.

To me that's the only refresh left that makes sense. But I would expect it to move up the value chain, with an MSRP of $2k or similar. The 4090 would perhaps remain.

Fallen Kell · Jan 31, 2024

BFG10K said:
It's basically a cheaper 4080. Still way too expensive.

Exactly, it needed to be $800-850, and the rest of the stack also needed to shift with that pricing, but they didn't want their record profits to be affected like that possibility.

MrTeal · Jan 31, 2024

Surprisingly it seems to have sold pretty well. 184 FE's sold from Best Buy Canada in 8 minutes. The 4070 Super FE dropped similar quantities and only sold ~120 units after 8 hours.

jpiniero · Jan 31, 2024

Oh and the 4090 Ti may not make much sense without additional bandwidth. The 4090 as it is seems extremely bandwidth limited.

gdansk · Jan 31, 2024

jpiniero said:
Oh and the 4090 Ti may not make much sense without additional bandwidth. The 4090 as it is seems extremely bandwidth limited.

They could upgrade from 21gbps chips to 23gbps or 24gbps. 9.5% or 14% more bandwidth could be enough when combined with up to 96MB L2 and up to 12.5% more SM.

But this really seems like a skip product if it does launch. A 3090 Ti repeat. Blackwell is 2024Q4 (as is tradition) or 2025Q1 (if delayed). And since we didn't hear any rumors yet 4090 Ti likely isn't near launch.

blckgrffn · Jan 31, 2024

jpiniero said:
Oh and the 4090 Ti may not make much sense without additional bandwidth. The 4090 as it is seems extremely bandwidth limited.

I think the L2 is just sitting there, waiting to be enabled. The reports I've read indicate that full AD102 has 96MB whereas the 4090 has a deep cut to 72MB. The resulting cache hit increases should be substantial, effectively increasing bandwidth with no other changes being made.

That's my understanding, am I wrong?

NVIDIA RTX 4090 to Feature 72MB of L2 Cache, RTX 4090 Ti Based on the Fully Enabled AD102 Die May Leverage 96MB [Report] | Hardware Times

NVIDIA’s next-gen Lovelace flagship, the RTX 4090 will reportedly feature 72MB of L2 cache. This is a steep cut from the 96MB available on the fully enabled AD102 die. According to Kopite7kimi, the memory subsystem of the upcoming Ada family is still family but “if everything goes well”, then...

www.hardwaretimes.com

A huge difference between the 4070 Ti Super and the 4080 is the reduction of L2 from 60 MB to 48 MB and it appears to make a huge difference - the actual increase in bandwidth seems nearly useless without the larger cache.

I would guess the 4090 Ti could be 10-15% faster with a full die enablement compared to the 4090. That's a substantial uplift, and likely worth whatever it costs for whom best possible performance is the only bogey.

amenx · Jan 31, 2024

Looks like they cut down out on the VRM phases:
4080 FE super - 11 phase GPU voltage, 2 phase memory
4080 FE - 13 phase GPU, 3 phase memory

PCB comparisons:

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 Super Founders Edition Review - Helping you Save $200

NVIDIA's new GeForce RTX 4080 Super introduces a noteworthy $200 price reduction compared to the non-Super 4080, placing significant pricing pressure on AMD's RX 7900 XTX. Despite this, the performance gains vs RTX 4080 non-Super are only marginal, we expected more.

www.techpowerup.com

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 Founders Edition Review - Energy-Efficient Beast

GeForce RTX 4080 launches today and offers fantastic gaming performance at 4K, with highest details. In our RTX 4080 Founders Edition review, we confirm that NVIDIA's new $1200 card beats the last-generation flagship RTX 3090 Ti conclusively, both in performance and value.

www.techpowerup.com

KompuKare · Jan 31, 2024

CB has it about 1% and 2% faster than the plain 4080 (RT is 1%, raster is 2%).

Now, what is the margin of errors in a benchmark suite?

Or for that matter, with the way Boost works these days is 1% possible by

Blowing at a card?
Opening a door in the test room?
Whispering to the card?
Passing wind in the card's vicinity?

So basically the 4080 Super is all about the $200 price cut to MSRP. Provided that isn't gobbled up by retailers, OEMs or even Nvidia setting an unreachable price point from the BOM - hence making it only possible with a few intro priced cards and a trickle of FE cards?

blckgrffn · Jan 31, 2024

KompuKare said:
CB has it about 1% and 2% faster than the plain 4080 (RT is 1%, raster is 2%).

Now, what is the margin of errors in a benchmark suite?

Or for that matter, with the way Boost works these days is 1% possible by

Blowing at a card?

Opening a door in the test room?

Whispering to the card?

Passing wind in the card's vicinity?

So basically the 4080 Super is all about the $200 price cut to MSRP. Provided that isn't gobbled up by retailers, OEMs or even Nvidia setting an unreachable price point from the BOM - hence making it only possible with a few intro priced cards and a trickle of FE cards?

Right?

I posted before a picture from Microcenter. I looks like the stock was predominantly made up of $999 models today. It looks like there are lot of additional options between $1k and $1,100 so it seems like a legit price cut to me.

I thought it might actually be 5% faster - which would be measurable - but as the Ars review pointed out, the 4080 regularly boosted to all sorts of frequencies so the fact the Super has the same power budget seems to make it operate as the same card, regardless of the GPU being elevated to its FINAL FORM.

Did NewEgg even have any stock today?

For those who posit stock levels indicate interest... well, if NewEgg had stock earlier this means there was some interest.

Aapje · Jan 31, 2024

Heartbreaker said:
I'd say it's mostly mission accomplished, the S cards improve NVidia positioning against AMD, making it much harder to choose an AMD card.

The AMD cards still don't look all that bad. Also, it's interesting that where in past you'd see people hoping that new AMD cards or AMD price drops will result in price drops for Nvidia, I now regularly see people commenting the opposite. It may indicate that a lot more people have written off Nvidia completely and are really just looking at AMD.

Heartbreaker said:
I'm surprised AMD has done essentially nothing to react.

It makes sense to wait a little to see how sales actually go. It's doubtful that the people running out to buy a 4080 S right now would buy a 7900 XTX at a slightly lower price.

Aapje · Jan 31, 2024

yottabit said:
I'll be holding out for the next gen (or next-next-next gen) cards to replace my 3070 since I mostly game at 1080p anyway

I would strongly suggest getting a 1440p screen when you upgrade again. I think that it makes a big difference.

blckgrffn · Jan 31, 2024

Aapje said:
I would strongly suggest getting a 1440p screen when you upgrade again. I think that it makes a big difference.

A premium 1440p panel is a true luxury, and they don’t have to cost that much. I second this.

SteveGrabowski · Jan 31, 2024

Aapje said:
I would strongly suggest getting a 1440p screen when you upgrade again. I think that it makes a big difference.

I'll third it. 1440p is so night and day better than 1080p, but as someone running a 28 inch 4k panel I don't notice too big a difference between 1440p, 1440p upscaled to 4k with FSR, and native 4k. If I could go back in time I would have just bought a 1440p 144Hz panel instead but that was back when it looked like Sony would never support 1440p and I also hook my PS5 up to the panel.

SteveGrabowski · Jan 31, 2024

JFC

moonbogg · Feb 1, 2024

I'm kind of glad I didn't try to wait for a 4080 super. It's only about 15% faster and there's a good chance I wouldn't have even been able to get one at msrp. The msrp models sold out. Yikes. Looks like $1000 is the new solidified high-end price. Enthusiast price is now $1600-2000+. Damn, lol. I guess the average gamer has a ton of money to burn on this stuff. Who'd a thought?

Aapje · Feb 1, 2024

moonbogg said:
I'm kind of glad I didn't try to wait for a 4080 super. It's only about 15% faster and there's a good chance I wouldn't have even been able to get one at msrp. The msrp models sold out. Yikes. Looks like $1000 is the new solidified high-end price. Enthusiast price is now $1600-2000+. Damn, lol. I guess the average gamer has a ton of money to burn on this stuff. Who'd a thought?

The average gamer buys 60-series cards, not 80-series.

Keep in mind that the people who comment on forums like these are far from average.

igor_kavinski · Feb 1, 2024

Aapje said:
Keep in mind that the people who comment on forums like these are far from average.

We seem to have a lot of lurkers on these forums who either think we are all idiots and just watch us argue for fun or they are too scared of how we will respond if they comment

Aapje · Feb 1, 2024

igor_kavinski said:
We seem to have a lot of lurkers on these forums who either think we are all idiots and just watch us argue for fun or they are too scared of how we will respond if they comment

True, but enough about Jensen and Su.

SMOGZINN · Feb 1, 2024

igor_kavinski said:
The company has enough in their coffers to give back to their loyal customers.

Wow, that is right out of the 50's. Companies no longer give back and haven't since at least the late 70's early 80's. Now, at best, a customer loyalty bonus means that they will give you some lube in the form of marketing that makes you feel good about buying their top end product instead of marketing that makes you feel bad about not buying the latest and greatest.

NV Super refresh reviews

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