Question How important it is to have UPS if I have a NAS?

[tablespoon]

Hi, if I add a NAS to my home network, how important it is to have a UPS?

 

[gdansk]

In my experience it is rather important if you're using hard drives. Many years ago I lost 2 hard drives in the same PC to sudden power loss during a thunderstorm.

 

[tablespoon]

I plan to put one Seagate Ironwolf in the NAS initially and see how it goes. Besides the NAS, is it recommended to connect also the PC (SSD and Nvidia RTX2080Ti installed) and perhaps also a networking switch to the UPS? Router is in another room so I cannot connect it to the UPS.

Is 1000VA sufficient? I wonder if 1350VA or 1500VA is overkilled.

 

[Tech Junky]

I've been running 5 drives for several years without a ups in a diy setup. A coupe of years ago there was rolling blackouts and outages for a couple of days. Drives had no issue. I do however have a huge surge protector on everything with a high joule rating over 1000 for protecting the devices.

A ups is more for extending the power for a graceful shutdown of systems connected to it. If things aren't configured for such an event it's a waste of money and time. Also they need to be tested periodically to make sure they work along with replacing the battery every couple of years.

 

[Golgatha]

I've been running 5 drives for several years without a ups in a diy setup. A coupe of years ago there was rolling blackouts and outages for a couple of days. Drives had no issue. I do however have a huge surge protector on everything with a high joule rating over 1000 for protecting the devices.

A ups is more for extending the power for a graceful shutdown of systems connected to it. If things aren't configured for such an event it's a waste of money and time. Also they need to be tested periodically to make sure they work along with replacing the battery every couple of years.

Agreed with everything here except the battery replacement cycle. Unless you're draining them regularly and having to cycle a recharge frequently, they should last 3+ years. I have 10 units between two houses currently on a 3.5 year replacement cycle and I test them roughly quarterly. Never had an issue with a battery going bad in that time frame. Also worth mentioning is I start looking to replace the actual UPS unit electronics when the 4th battery cycle comes up; I'll buy a new unit at that point. I'm considering doing it on the 3rd cycle because I've had a couple of units die in that 10-12 year window now.

 

[aigomorla]

Is 1000VA sufficient? I wonder if 1350VA or 1500VA is overkilled.

there is no such thing as overkill for a UPS.
Its more like can you afford it or not, and will it fit or not.
The larger is always better, because it means more run time incase something happens.

The only time i will stick with small UPS's is because its the only one that i can fit in that location.

I plan to put one Seagate Ironwolf in the NAS initially and see how it goes.

No... just NO....
Seagate is on my not so nice list, as all the hard drives they make have been utter garbage in reliability, except for the enterprise class Exos with SAS interface.

Which i do not think you will be looking at.

Stick with the true and trusted WD Red Pro or the CMR versions of the Red Plus.
Or get WD HC510 series, which are also known as the ever so popular HGST He's.

 

[Tech Junky]

larger is always bette

In that case look at nat gas generators.

 

[aigomorla]

In that case look at nat gas generators.

im actually in the middle of getting permits to get this installed:



I have the 12kw solar array.
Its just down to either a tesla wall, or a DIY bank.
Im more leanning to the DIY because i can service it and change out the 48V LiPoFe units myself as its just 4U racks.
But the Tesla Wall makes monitoring stupidly easy, also i can mount a tesla wall outside.
But regardless both require electrical permits to be filled.

 

[Shmee]

For a NAS, you want minimum 2 drives IMO, for redundancy. A UPS might be a good idea, so that you can gracefully power off during an outage. I have a 1500VA UPS, but that is for my desktop and monitor, as they are the most expensive. I could get a separate one for my NAS, but so far the NAS has been fine in any power outages. TrueNAS seems pretty resilient, and ECC RAM helps. Last time there was a power outage before I got the UPS, my system NVMe SSD on my desktop was killed. I am just getting a replacement under warranty shipped soon, still hasn't arrived yet.

As for the drives, Ironwolf Pro would be decent, but I would definitely go with higher tier NAS HDDs or enterprise HDDs. As mentioned, Exos Enterprise, probably SATA though, or WD gold or Red Pro. Or even Red Plus. Just make sure it is CMR and suitable for NAS/enterprise. I generally shop by warranty as well, try to get one with 5 years. And be careful of 3rd party sellers on amazon and the like, they typically don't have full warranty.

Back to UPS, I would get one for desktop first probably, as the video card and SSDs are generally more expensive and can be more susceptible to power loss I find. But it also depends on what are the internals of the NAS, and how much each component costs on both systems. What do you plan on using for the NAS hardware, and what OS?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Just my .02 - Get the UPS as big as possible for the NAS. Also, Backup your important data to offline storage. I personally have 2 different 12TB USB drives I use to backup mine. I have an 8TB "hot backup" in my PC that I back the NAS data files to as well.

 

[Shmee]

Ah, the above is important, and should not be overlooked. Be sure to have multiple backups, in different locations, some offline. The key is redundancy of your critical files. And why offline? This way, less likely to be zapped by lightning, or shredded by malware. And different locations, in case your place burns down or someone breaks in and steals your gear. You could keep a 10+ TB HDD in safe deposit or offsite storage, where it could store tons of important data.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Ah, the above is important, and should not be overlooked. Be sure to have multiple backups, in different locations, some offline. The key is redundancy of your critical files. And why offline? This way, less likely to be zapped by lightning, or shredded by malware. And different locations, in case your place burns down or someone breaks in and steals your gear. You could keep a 10+ TB HDD in safe deposit or offsite storage, where it could store tons of important data.

In my time servicing small to medium businesses, it's always a little amazing the "tech" people they hired overlooked this simple premise....thinking RAID was a backup solution. smh....just nuts.

 

[Golgatha]

Ah, the above is important, and should not be overlooked. Be sure to have multiple backups, in different locations, some offline. The key is redundancy of your critical files. And why offline? This way, less likely to be zapped by lightning, or shredded by malware. And different locations, in case your place burns down or someone breaks in and steals your gear. You could keep a 10+ TB HDD in safe deposit or offsite storage, where it could store tons of important data.

I like these bags to transport my hard drives offsite.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08XLWNMKL

 

[Golgatha]

In my time servicing small to medium businesses, it's always a little amazing the "tech" people they hired overlooked this simple premise....thinking RAID was a backup solution. smh....just nuts.

Things people need to hear - RAID is not a backup!!!

 

[Golgatha]

Just my .02 - Get the UPS as big as possible for the NAS. Also, Backup your important data to offline storage. I personally have 2 different 12TB USB drives I use to backup mine. I have an 8TB "hot backup" in my PC that I back the NAS data files to as well.

Similar setup here. I have a file server for the hot backups (2x12TB and 10TB spinners), a daily sync to another hot backup residing on my gaming rig (16TB spinner), 2x18TB USB 3.0 drives (one onsite and one offsite, rotating between work and home). Using VeraCrypt to encrypt all the aforementioned drives. I create a (currently) 7GB file container with VeraCrypt to backup critical documents (scans of legal doc, taxes, etc.) and upload to my Google Drive as needed as well. Every once in a blue moon, I write one of these file containers to M-Disc.

 

[aigomorla]

Things people need to hear - RAID is not a backup!!!

YEAH! its a BUG SPRAY! (sorry i had to say it)

 

[tablespoon]

I know RAID is not backup. Why many people spend a lot of money to buy several hard drives for RAID? Is it for performance or they are delusional?

 

[Golgatha]

I know RAID is not backup. Why many people spend a lot of money to buy several hard drives for RAID? Is it for performance or they are delusional?

RAID0 for performance other types of RAID for uptime is really the short answer for all of it.

This is a personal preference of mine, but the 2x12TB in my file server is basically a mirrored set of data that gets synced daily. I could use RAID1 for those, but I'd rather eliminate the complexity of setting it up. Also, it's saved my bacon a time or two when I accidentally deleted a file, which is an example of a case where RAID1 doesn't help you. If one of my drives dies, I might lose that day worth of changes, but I still get the benefit of having zero downtime for the most part.

 

[aigomorla]

I know RAID is not backup. Why many people spend a lot of money to buy several hard drives for RAID? Is it for performance or they are delusional?

because when you setup RAID properly, and you have a 10GBe, you can pull off speeds like this from PC -> PC over network on regular 7200rpm hard drives.

And you can pull this off on a nVME.

These are all PC -> PC transfer OVER network via 10gbe.


My NAS is a mix of Raid-Z and Raid-Z2 on 2 different arrays.
Z2 gets things which are super important.
Z gets normal stuff like movies.

Z2 allows 2 drives to die before what i know as my life disappearing.
(well not exactly, i have 2 offsite backups for it, and 1 onsite different machine.)

Z allows 1 drive only.


I also use Raid10 on my windows machine server, which is sort of like Raid-0 then mirror it with another Raid-0.

 

[Golgatha]

because when you setup RAID properly, and you have a 10GBe, you can pull off speeds like this from PC -> PC over network on regular 7200rpm hard drives.

And you can pull this off on a nVME.

These are all PC -> PC transfer OVER network via 10gbe.


My NAS is a mix of Raid-Z and Raid-Z2 on 2 different arrays.
Z2 gets things which are super important.
Z gets normal stuff like movies.

Z2 allows 2 drives to die before what i know as my life disappearing.
(well not exactly, i have 2 offsite backups for it, and 1 onsite different machine.)

Z allows 1 drive only.


I also use Raid10 on my windows machine server, which is sort of like Raid-0 then mirror it with another Raid-0.

I'm cheap and can wait for my files to sync. I use 2.5Gbit ethernet so my spinners aren't bottlenecked, but even 7200rpm RAID0 would be bottlenecked by my LAN connection (solid state to solid state max is about 290MB/sec) currently.

Side note - I think it's fun that my laptop is faster wirelessly (1.7-1.8Gb) than some of the wired connections in my home. I have a Zyxel WAX610D with a 2.5Gb backhaul making that happen.

 

[aigomorla]

I'm cheap and can wait for my files to sync. I use 2.5Gbit

I bet you my original 10gbe switch was cheaper then your 2.5.
I used a Mikrotik 5 port one SFP+.
When people didn't know much about mikrotik that switch costed me like 92 dollars, for 4 SFP+ 10gbe.
Then i used retired out Mellanox SFP+ cards at 15 dollars each.

I setup my 10gbe homelab spending about 150 dollars initially just to play around with it.

Now im addicted to 10gbe.... i want 40gbe, but i also like to be able to hear things, which you can't, if you ever heard how loud a 40gbe switch is.

My 10gbe switch is passive and silent.
This is what i use now.

MikroTik CRS309-1G-8S+IN Review Inexpensive 8x 10GbE Switch

In our MikroTik CRS309-1G-8S+IN review, we show what this low-cost, low-power, and silent 8x 10GbE SFP+ switch offers and when it can be used

www.servethehome.com

You can't get quieter then that.
These are the two switches i feel in love with... the top is the 5 port i mentioned.

 

[Tech Junky]

I know RAID is not backup. Why many people spend a lot of money to buy several hard drives for RAID? Is it for performance or they are delusional?

It's about performance and speed along with virtual capacity. There are several different raid options form pure speed I raid 0 to mirroring with raid 1 there are hybrid options that combine raid versions like raid 10. There's raid 5 which uses a parity drive for recovery. Raid 50/60 and so on.

It's not a backup but it's safer than a single disk with your precious data. For vital data I put files on the cloud. Let someone else cover the disk costs. When you audit the data you have when it comes to TBs of data how much of it could you not live without? Most of it isn't something you couldn't live without.

 

[Golgatha]

I bet you my original 10gbe switch was cheaper then your 2.5.
I used a Mikrotik 5 port one SFP+.
When people didn't know much about mikrotik that switch costed me like 92 dollars, for 4 SFP+ 10gbe.
Then i used retired out Mellanox SFP+ cards at 15 dollars each.

I setup my 10gbe homelab spending about 150 dollars initially just to play around with it.

Now im addicted to 10gbe.... i want 40gbe, but i also like to be able to hear things, which you can't, if you ever heard how loud a 40gbe switch is.

My 10gbe switch is passive and silent.
This is what i use now.

MikroTik CRS309-1G-8S+IN Review Inexpensive 8x 10GbE Switch

In our MikroTik CRS309-1G-8S+IN review, we show what this low-cost, low-power, and silent 8x 10GbE SFP+ switch offers and when it can be used

www.servethehome.com

You can't get quieter then that.
These are the two switches i feel in love with... the top is the 5 port i mentioned.

Nice setup! I assume you'd need to buy client NICs too at added cost.

I just have a QNAP 5-port 2.5Gb unmanaged switch I bought for about $110. It uses existing Cat5e/6 cabling, and my file server, the Zyxel AP (I use a 2.5Gb POE+ injector for this), and a couple of my computers have 2.5Gb ports built-in, so no additional client NIC costs. The 5th port is uplinked to a $20 1Gb switch for more mundane stuff like TVs, gaming consoles, laser printer, etc. I'm lucky and have Google Fiber 1Gb service for Internet service.