POLL: x86 vs ARM vs RISC-V; What is your favourite CPU ISA?

[igor_kavinski]

And could be (theoretically) reprogrammed to run a different ISA than x86.

Theoretically the CPU to end all ISAs except its own

 

[FlameTail]

 

[igor_kavinski]

View attachment 92824

Yes, by all means take CPU advice from a GPU guy

https://www.reddit.com/r/IntelArc/comments/12up1x3

 

[moinmoin]

View attachment 92824

Infame of the messenger aside, one has nothing to do with the other. It's not up to the ISA how CPU and iGPU share the package and platform. Is there even any ISA that addresses both at once?

 

[FlameTail]

Indeed. Strix Halo will be a move in this direction.

 

[moinmoin]

Indeed. Strix Halo will be a move in this direction.

If you are really answering my post there, I can only strongly suggest you to look up the definition of ISA...

 

[FlameTail]

If you are really answering my post there, I can only strongly suggest you to look up the definition of ISA...

No, no, no, no......

 

[Nothingness]

An interesting read about instruction set design: https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=3639445

It shows a few shortcomings of (base) RISC-V.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Since I'm not programming in Assembler the background details of the architecture really don't matter. What I mostly care about is compatibility.

x86 is compatible with all my games, so x86 is still my favorite.

 

[FlameTail]

How did x86 accumulate such a thumping majority in the poll?

 

[Nothingness]

That's people who express their preference because that's their platform of choice to play or work

 

[igor_kavinski]

Because no one can configure their own smartphone the way they want. But anyone can define their perfect PC configuration that reflects their preferences and their needs. Until ARM invades this space, it will be relegated to making apps that people use but don't really love because few know how to keep a copy of their favorite app or mobile game and keep it working offline for years and years.

I can still fire up my copy of X-Wing Alliance and blow up Empire scum to bits. I can still run Windows 3.1 in a VM. There are people out there who have decades old applications that they love but that are abandonware. They can still run those and be productive. Once the people behind ARM understand this, they may have a chance of elevating ARM's status in the eyes of enthusiasts.

 

[Nothingness]

I can still fire up my copy of X-Wing Alliance and blow up Empire scum to bits. I can still run Windows 3.1 in a VM. There are people out there who have decades old applications that they love but that are abandonware. They can still run those and be productive. Once the people behind ARM understand this, they may have a chance of elevating ARM's status in the eyes of enthusiasts.

I would argue that any game you can run in Windows 3.1 in a VM will be playable on any Arm platform as this goes through simulation (Windows doesn't support 16-bit code as far as I know). So that's not a good example

I agree with most of the rest of your post, but that doesn't change my point of view: x86 stinks as an ISA and that was the question asked here

 

[Heartbreaker]

How did x86 accumulate such a thumping majority in the poll?

See my post right above yours.

 

[FlameTail]

Because no one can configure their own smartphone the way they want. But anyone can define their perfect PC configuration that reflects their preferences and their needs. Until ARM invades this space, it will be relegated to making apps that people use but don't really love because few know how to keep a copy of their favorite app or mobile game and keep it working offline for years and years.

I can still fire up my copy of X-Wing Alliance and blow up Empire scum to bits. I can still run Windows 3.1 in a VM. There are people out there who have decades old applications that they love but that are abandonware. They can still run those and be productive. Once the people behind ARM understand this, they may have a chance of elevating ARM's status in the eyes of enthusiasts.

Interesting. Then I do not belong to that category of enthusiasts.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Interesting. Then I do not belong to that category of enthusiasts.

You are smartphone/Raspberry Pi peasant!

 

[FlameTail]

You are smartphone/Raspberry Pi peasant!

Thou shalt not dare speak thus.

We will overthrow all you lords and ladies, and put your x86 to guillotine!

The Revolution is coming.

 

[FlameTail]

It does raise an interesting point of discussion though.

I have never been a PCMR kind of guy. Really an r/hardware type of guy, if you will. I guess it makes sense though, as a young Gen-Zer.

We grew up in the era of smartphones, in an era of mobile computing. A philosophy which favoured efficiency and mobility over raw performance. Besides, PC building is an expensive hobby.

Also, Gen Z seems to mostly favour the software side of computing than the hardware side. (Atleast in the West, that is. Which is why there is a shortage of semiconductor workers).

 

[Nothingness]

I am old enough to think that (IBM) PC, x86 and MS were a disaster because they killed the competition. But it can't be denied their success helped have a common platform on which to build and use software for years and years.

Also, Gen Z seems to mostly favour the software side of computing than the hardware side.

I taught microprocessor architecture at master level in the 90s. I did it again in the 2000s. The feeling and the response were vastly different. Needless to say it was better in the 90s. And I guess this has been getting worse and worse

 

[igor_kavinski]

It doesn't help that hardware is harder and mistakes can be very expensive. Crappy software is forgiven all the time.

 

[Heartbreaker]

I am old enough to think that (IBM) PC, x86 and MS were a disaster because they killed the competition. But it can't be denied their success helped have a common platform on which to build and use software for years and years.


I taught microprocessor architecture at master level in the 90s. I did it again in the 2000s. The feeling and the response were vastly different. Needless to say it was better in the 90s. And I guess this has been getting worse and worse

I owned an Amiga in the late 1980's and was annoyed that PCs and the "worse" kludgy x86 architecture won, over the more elegant Motorola 68K architecture.

But then I grew up.

IMO, People get too wrapped up about architecture minutia has absolutely zero impact on them.

 

[moinmoin]

To be fair hand crafted assembly code has been very important for a long time for achieving decent performance. I recall all emulator authors in the 90s and early 2000s to boast about optimized assembly and all kinds of shortcuts to even get close to running emulated systems at the real speed. Nowadays the performance available is such that we constantly throw unoptimized bloatware at CPUs and don't care anymore about completely ridiculous insanely deep dependency chains that fail at basic security once you look at it.

 

[igor_kavinski]

@FlameTail , enjoy!

NO EXECUTE! January 16, 2024

 

[Nothingness]

I owned an Amiga in the late 1980's and was annoyed that PCs and the "worse" kludgy x86 architecture won, over the more elegant Motorola 68K architecture.

But then I grew up.

IMO, People get too wrapped up about architecture minutia has absolutely zero impact on them.

You make it sound as if people explaining why they prefer an ISA over other ones are childish

This thread was about discussing the merits of ISA; several people expressed their preference and the reasons why. It was not about what is the best ISA for end users at the moment, in which case you'd have had two groups: PC/x86 vs Mac/Arm users.

 

[Tup3x]

From technical (or low lever programming) point of view I don't have any preferences since I don't do low level coding. What I don't like is the current duopoly going on in PC market. I'd like to see much more competition and options from multiple different manufacturers. ARM Windows might change that in the near future and I'm interested to see how things go.