Discussion RDNA4 + CDNA3 Architectures Thread

[DisEnchantment]

With the GFX940 patches in full swing since first week of March, it is looking like MI300 is not far in the distant future!
Usually AMD takes around 3Qs to get the support in LLVM and amdgpu. Lately, since RDNA2 the window they push to add support for new devices is much reduced to prevent leaks.
But looking at the flurry of code in LLVM, it is a lot of commits. Maybe because US Govt is starting to prepare the SW environment for El Capitan (Maybe to avoid slow bring up situation like Frontier for example)

See here for the GFX940 specific commits

History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

The LLVM Project is a collection of modular and reusable compiler and toolchain technologies. - History for llvm/lib/Target/AMDGPU - llvm/llvm-project

github.com

Or Phoronix

More AMD "GFX940" Enablement Work Landing In LLVM - Phoronix

www.phoronix.com

There is a lot more if you know whom to follow in LLVM review chains (before getting merged to github), but I am not going to link AMD employees.

I am starting to think MI300 will launch around the same time like Hopper probably only a couple of months later!
Although I believe Hopper had problems not having a host CPU capable of doing PCIe 5 in the very near future therefore it might have gotten pushed back a bit until SPR and Genoa arrives later in 2022.
If PVC slips again I believe MI300 could launch before it

This is nuts, MI100/200/300 cadence is impressive.



Previous thread on CDNA2 and RDNA3 here

Question - Speculation: RDNA3 + CDNA2 Architectures Thread

Man I have been dying to make this one for a while now. First rumours for RDNA3 are here so new thread time! Just going to start off with this one for now: kopite7kimi on Twitter: "@VideoCardz Ah, I mean a simple mcm design with 10240 cores is not enough. Because the lift from RDNA2 to RDNA3...

forums.anandtech.com

 

[beginner99]

You win it by building the biggest halo part out there and they just gotta be willing.

for sure not. You win marketshare by having the best deals in the mainstream segments. And the best deal is a combination of performance, price, power use and longevity. Last point is to exclude the VRAM gimped NV products. Right now AMD is essential absent from said market because the 7600 is to weak and too expensive.

N32 must be really, really broken for them to still not have released it. Or they really to have a huge montain of N21 dies left which they intentionally only trickled out slowly to maintain price thereby pushing N32 even further back. Due to the slow market n5 volume can't really be the problem.

 

[jpiniero]

N32 must be really, really broken for them to still not have released it. Or they really to have a huge montain of N21 dies left which they intentionally only trickled out slowly to maintain price thereby pushing N32 even further back. Due to the slow market n5 volume can't really be the problem.

Given that the 6800 XT's been selling for 20% below the MSRP.... I wouldn't really call that maintaining price.

 

[adroc_thurston]

for sure not

Yes.
Absolutely.

You win marketshare by having the best deals in the mainstream segments

Yes.
Kill your margin!
great idea.

N32 must be really, really broken for them to still not have released it

It was used as a living test subject.
It happens.

 

[beginner99]

Yes.
Kill your margin!
great idea.

It's not black and white. You lower the margin but increase volume so your profits in the end will be higher.

But I specifically said "best deal" which doesn't mean "cheapest". But if you use more power especially at idle with multi-monitor setups and have worse software then yeah performance/$ is your main selling point besides more vram. If AMD didn't have more vram than NV, why would I even consider an AMD car unless it was clearly cheaper?

And I do see the need for "upscaling". I don't game that often anymore but 4k would be nice for work. ut spending 1k on a gpu just isn't worth it for the amount I use it. so a cheaper one and then upscale to 4k makes so much sense for "casual" gaming in times of remote working.

 

[adroc_thurston]

You lower the margin but increase volume so your profits in the end will be higher.

You lower the margin to maybe force NV to drop theirs to retain mss.
No one buys Radeon, the plebs only want it to exist to dump NV pricing.

But if you use more power especially at idle with multi-monitor setups

That's oddly specific to RDOA3 parts.
RDOA2 was more efficient at everything and not a single soul ever cared about that.

And I do see the need for "upscaling"

To think people threw a fit over checkerboarded PS4 Pro 4k some 6 years ago.

 

[Aapje]

RDOA3

This kind of childishness just reflects badly on you.

 

[Timorous]

And I do see the need for "upscaling". I don't game that often anymore but 4k would be nice for work. ut spending 1k on a gpu just isn't worth it for the amount I use it. so a cheaper one and then upscale to 4k makes so much sense for "casual" gaming in times of remote working.

Unfortunately that will die soon. Devs will use the extra headroom upscaling provides to do less optimisation so your cheaper card that could run 1080p/1440p native just fine and with a bit of upscaling help can manage 4k will now need upscaling to run at 1080p at 1440p.

 

[Shmee]

How much do we know about RDNA4 yet? I presume very little, but is there a chance that the chiplet design could allow new HBM tech to be put on each MCD for high end cards? In reference to some of the news here https://www.anandtech.com/show/18981/micron-unveils-hbm3-gen2-12-tbs-per-stack-at-92-gts-speed

 

[Heartbreaker]

How much do we know about RDNA4 yet? I presume very little, but is there a chance that the chiplet design could allow new HBM tech to be put on each MCD for high end cards? In reference to some of the news here https://www.anandtech.com/show/18981/micron-unveils-hbm3-gen2-12-tbs-per-stack-at-92-gts-speed

HBM seems too expensive for consumers. They all use it for data center, but not for consumer.

 

[Heartbreaker]

It's not black and white. You lower the margin but increase volume so your profits in the end will be higher.

That only works if your competitor decides to ignore your move on market share. Chances are your price cut just starts a price war and you and your competitor just end up losing margin, while maintaining the same market share.

There might be some temporary increase in overall sales as some buy early from better pricing, but it wouldn't be enough to make up margin loss.

I'm buying a new GPU this year. If there was a price war, I would still only buy one GPU, and after I have it, I'm going to keep it for years.

 

[Aapje]

@Heartbreaker

The extra sales due to lower prices is not from people upgrading to two cards, but people upgrading sooner than they would otherwise.

And in a functioning market, prices will indeed match the relative quality of the product, with a healthy margin. Nvidia bragging that they managed to greatly increase the margins is a sign of an anti-competitive situation.

 

[Heartbreaker]

@Heartbreaker

The extra sales due to lower prices is not from people upgrading to two cards, but people upgrading sooner than they would otherwise.

Upgrading sooner, is just a temporary blip though. If prices dropped drastically tomorrow, I would upgrade tomorrow, but all that is doing is moving sale forward a month or two, then I'm back out of the market for years.

But sure, bring on the price war, it will benefit me, but I doubt it happens because really it benefits neither AMD nor NVidia.

 

[adroc_thurston]

This kind of childishness just reflects badly on you.

Why? It's relatively funny and acutely describes RDNA3 market positioning (when you miss, the product cycle turns hell for you).

but is there a chance that the chiplet design could allow new HBM tech to be put on each MCD for high end cards

Zero.
X3D MCDs are a thing, HBMs on client are not.

 

[tajoh111]

This kind of childishness just reflects badly on you.

How about the popular term on here Ngreedia?

AMD and Nvidia have been both equally greedy this generation but no one is calling AMD AMGREED.

The only thing that has been well priced from AMD this generation is last generation's clearance.

Everything else has been Nvidia like. Considering AMD Chiplet design helps them save money and their flagships are now sized like midrange dies, they have less reason to raise their prices.

RDNA3 is clearly a failure if we go by AMD's advertising of the performance per watt and expectations before release. But we are still paying prices as if AMD succeeded.

The gap in performance between the 7900 xtx and the RTX 4090 is much larger than the GAP between the 6900xt and the RTX 4090 and yet the price difference is pretty much the same. The only difference is AMD is matching Nvidia for Vram capacity but shrinking their chip dramatically. Personally I would trade 520mm2 of 5nm chip with 16gb of ram vs 300mm2 of 5nm chip and 24gb of memory.

If AMD is using chiplets more so to increase or maintain margins rather than performance, and the performance of their products reflects this, they should be cheaper and significantly more so than Nvidia.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

My personal favorite is AyyyMD.

It really meant to encapsulate the frustration of people who like AMD watching AMD's blunders and missteps, rather than be a childish insult from a hater.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

How about the popular term on here Ngreedia?

Could you find posts by even a small number, say 5 different members, using it? Maybe I am just skimming by it?

 

[moinmoin]

Could you find posts by even a small number, say 5 different members, using it? Maybe I am just skimming by it?

Skimming the search result for it implies the amount of users actively using it doubled through the mention in this thread. That's an enormous worrying rise!

 

[Ajay]

IDK - used 50-60 times. Didn't check usernames.

 

[igor_kavinski]

HeartBreaker used it, I loved it and adopted it.

BUT, first ever use on these forums seems to be by some now-gone bloke: http://www.portvapes.co.uk/?id=Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps&exid=thread...performance-for-299-usd.2471298/post-38189041

 

[igor_kavinski]

Ahem.



So Heartbreaker is actually guidryp? I didn't know display names could be changed.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

HeartBreaker used it, I loved it and adopted it.

BUT, first ever use on these forums seems to be by some now-gone bloke: http://www.portvapes.co.uk/?id=Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps&exid=thread...performance-for-299-usd.2471298/post-38189041

You had to go back to 2016? And you confess to being one of the primary users of the term; I think we're done here.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Ahem.

View attachment 83834

So Heartbreaker is actually guidryp? I didn't know display names could be changed.

You can change it in your user settings. Just like switching to the dark theme. Abuse it and I'll spank ya. 🤪

 

[Aapje]

Upgrading sooner, is just a temporary blip though. If prices dropped drastically tomorrow, I would upgrade tomorrow, but all that is doing is moving sale forward a month or two, then I'm back out of the market for years.

But if they kept giving great price/performance improvements, you'd upgrade again relatively soon.

People who keep using old cards instead of buying a new one do result in lost sales.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

My personal favorite is AyyyMD.

It really meant to encapsulate the frustration of people who like AMD watching AMD's blunders and missteps, rather than be a childish insult from a hater.

It's Fonzi my dude. You are too young to know what's up. 👍

 

[Ajay]

Hmm, maybe after 20 years I should change mine. And the avatar, and my sig. Then not post for a few days and no one will know who I am anymore .
Pigsly, Frunkenstien, coragulusIII, nerfballwizard....