Seriously consider moving to Linux

[WilliamM2]

I'm going to suggest what may seem to be a radical strategy to you: Stop at the point of saying "I've never experienced that before" and acknowledge that your experience is not definitive.

I would have, but you started arguing after I said that, that I WAS seeing these things.

Why not just admit that you don't know how to set up windows?

 

[mikeymikec]

I would have, but you started arguing after I said that, that I WAS seeing these things.

No: I questioned you specifically on one point to confirm that you truly hadn't seen one of the most notorious messages in Win10/11 because frankly I was amazed.

Why not just admit that you don't know how to set up windows?

Please, sir, put your penis away. I don't want to see it. This website is meant to be family-friendly.

---

I'm done arguing with you.

 

[WilliamM2]

I'm done arguing with you.

Glad to hear it.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Anyway: https://www.techspot.com/news/10177...ve-windows-11-upgrade-campaign-intrusive.html

 

[Ajay]

Load up Arch Linux or Manjaro Linux and try running your favorite games under Wine. If the experience is acceptable, say bye bye to Windows. Another game focused distro is POP_OS but I've read that Arch has Valve's blessing and Manjaro is based on Arch.

Tried that - too many problems. Some can be solved by doing this and that (edit the conf file, use this command line to launch, blah, blah) - but then a game update screws that over. I don't want more problems - I want less.

 

[pmv]

Dual boot? Then play about with various options such as Wine or playing under Linux natively and/or fall back to Windows for gaming?

I have my old PC set to dual boot - have to use ubuntu for certain things anyway. But trying to get games to work I suspect will be a painful amount of effort.

In reality I mostly use the PC for 'curating' my irrationally-large music and podcast and audiobook collections.

It's bugging me the way that the larger those collections become, the more dependent I am on keeping the machine running and the more imposing a prospect switching platforms or upgrading becomes. Feels as if it's all gotten a bit out-of-hand somewhere along the line.

 

[igor_kavinski]

But trying to get games to work I suspect will be a painful amount of effort.

In reality I mostly use the PC for 'curating' my irrationally-large music and podcast and audiobook collections.

There's CrossOver from Codeweavers that may offer better compatibility than Wine. But not free.

Music/podcast/audiobooks shouldn't be dependent on Windows unless they are tied to some really draconian DRM.

 

[max347]

FWIW, I’ve never seen any other operating system need an “easy 8 step process to remove ads”. https://www.howtogeek.com/how-to-disable-microsofts-ads-and-recommendations-in-windows-11/

 

[manly]

There's CrossOver from Codeweavers that may offer better compatibility than Wine. But not free.

Music/podcast/audiobooks shouldn't be dependent on Windows unless they are tied to some really draconian DRM.

It's mostly free nowadays because with Steam Deck, Valve is driving the gaming on Linux bus.

 

[Triloby]

Load up Arch Linux or Manjaro Linux and try running your favorite games under Wine. If the experience is acceptable, say bye bye to Windows. Another game focused distro is POP_OS but I've read that Arch has Valve's blessing and Manjaro is based on Arch.

You don't need to choose specific distros. Any Linux distro can run your games through Wine/Proton. As long as both Steam and Proton are installed (through either native packages or containers [Flatpak, Snap, etc.]), the end result should be the same.

Outside of Steam, apps such as Lutris and Heroic Games Launcher are there for your GOG, Uplay, Battle.net, EA Games, and Epic Games purchases. Then there's Bottles to help streamline setups of Windows apps through Wine, if you can't play your games through either Steam, Lutris, or Heroic.

The real big issue are games that require anti-cheat solutions that simply won't work on Linux through Proton/Wine. ProtonDB can tell you what's playable and unplayable on Linux.

https://www.protondb.com/

 

[pcgeek11]

I had been running Windows 10 on my notebook since it came out and I have been running Linux Mint on my desktop for several years. I've puttered around with Linux since the Redhat Version # 3 and I'm fairly comfortable.

I was pushed over the edge by Microsoft's insistence I either update to Windows 11 ( which I tried and hate ) or pay for extended support for Windows 10.

I dumped Windows from my notebook and now I'm running 100% Linux on my computers. I just need to support my wife's Windows 10 desktop as she refuses to learn anything new.

 

[Indus]

I had been running Windows 10 on my notebook since it came out and I have been running Linux Mint on my desktop for several years. I've puttered around with Linux since the Redhat Version # 3 and I'm fairly comfortable.

I was pushed over the edge by Microsoft's insistence I either update to Windows 11 ( which I tried and hate ) or pay for extended support for Windows 10.

I dumped Windows from my notebook and now I'm running 100% Linux on my computers. I just need to support my wife's Windows 10 desktop as she refuses to learn anything new.

Same here.. I still have a dual boot for gaming but I will never be going to Windows 11 or 12.

Cinnamon desktop just works.. it's like windows 7.

Hell I don't even wanna argue which kind of linux distro anyone uses as long as it's available in a cinnamon flavor.

 

[mikeymikec]

I tried dual-booting on my Dell XPS 13 9343 and it appeared to work at a glance but a very odd thing happened with the audio capability in that it may or may not work in Linux then continued to not work under Windows after a reboot. I gave up on it and clean installed Win10, fine ever since.

 

[Indus]

BTW @pcgeek11

I got my dad used to Linux Mint since he just wants to browse using google chrome and youtube in it..

How come your wife can't get used to that in Linux Mint? Is she using some majorly important software or something?

Because you can skin Linux Mint to look like Windows 10.. just do the following:

1. System Settings
2. Themes
3. Go to Add/Remove tab (on top)
4. Select Windows 10 Light and click the down arrow to download.
5. Go to Themes tab
6. Select it in Desktop setting (bottom).

 

[pcgeek11]

BTW @pcgeek11

I got my dad used to Linux Mint since he just wants to browse using google chrome and youtube in it..

How come your wife can't get used to that in Linux Mint? Is she using some majorly important software or something?

Because you can skin Linux Mint to look like Windows 10.. just do the following:

1. System Settings
2. Themes
3. Go to Add/Remove tab (on top)
4. Select Windows 10 Light and click the down arrow to download.
5. Go to Themes tab
6. Select it in Desktop setting (bottom).

I've fought and lost this battle too many times with this and many other things. She hates change period. I guess that is why I'm still around, LOL.

Thanks for the tip anyway...

 

[pmv]

Seriously wondering what I'm going to do when Win10 goes out of support (apparently October next year). No more security updates, I hear. So won't be able to put the main PC on-line at all (it's not good enough to upgrade to 11, apparently, would have to get a new CPU and motherboard, so a complete rebuild).

Maybe will just use the (even) older PC with Linux for everything internet and keep the win10 box as is for strictly-off-line gaming?

Will be a problem for Steam games and podcast downloading. Maybe eventually migrate everything to Linux? Really resenting the effort it's all going to take.

 

[Indus]

Seriously wondering what I'm going to do when Win10 goes out of support (apparently October next year). No more security updates, I hear. So won't be able to put the main PC on-line at all (it's not good enough to upgrade to 11, apparently, would have to get a new CPU and motherboard, so a complete rebuild).

Maybe will just use the (even) older PC with Linux for everything internet and keep the win10 box as is for strictly-off-line gaming?

Will be a problem for Steam games and podcast downloading. Maybe eventually migrate everything to Linux? Really resenting the effort it's all going to take.

You do know Linux can be used with Steam and Steam has proton which allows almost all windows games to be played in Proton if you don't mind a 15% fps hit, mostly due to drivers.

If you play shooters, it may be a big deal but for an mmo player, no sir.

My difficulty is I love debian based distro's that are stable - Linux Mint.. however games love updates and patches.. so I'm going to have to force myself to either like Fedora once it has a Cinnamon distro or just put SteamOS as an OS.

 

[manly]

Seriously wondering what I'm going to do when Win10 goes out of support (apparently October next year). No more security updates, I hear. So won't be able to put the main PC on-line at all (it's not good enough to upgrade to 11, apparently, would have to get a new CPU and motherboard, so a complete rebuild).

Maybe will just use the (even) older PC with Linux for everything internet and keep the win10 box as is for strictly-off-line gaming?

Will be a problem for Steam games and podcast downloading. Maybe eventually migrate everything to Linux? Really resenting the effort it's all going to take.

You can pay extra for extended Win10 updates. MS hasn't announced consumer pricing yet, but business pricing sucks.

There are also LTSC/IoT variants with longer support, but I'm not sure how that works.

 

[igor_kavinski]

So won't be able to put the main PC on-line at all (it's not good enough to upgrade to 11

Specs?

You can get a new drive and install Windows 11 on it with the compatibility checks disabled by creating a Windows setup USB with Rufus. If everything goes well, take it out and set it aside and use it once Windows 10 seems too old to be usable for day to day use. I'm typing this from Windows 8.1. Still functional for browsing. Steam and launchers for other game stores like Epic and Ubisoft may refuse to work. Who knows? I don't really game on this laptop.

 

[lantis3]

You do know Linux can be used with Steam and Steam has proton which allows almost all windows games to be played in Proton if you don't mind a 15% fps hit, mostly due to drivers.

If you play shooters, it may be a big deal but for an mmo player, no sir.

My difficulty is I love debian based distro's that are stable - Linux Mint.. however games love updates and patches.. so I'm going to have to force myself to either like Fedora once it has a Cinnamon distro or just put SteamOS as an OS.

During the weekend my Intel 10th gen laptop's Win11 just screwed up. Somehow it suddenly won't open any VMware VM and said it's either invalid format or there was internal error. I then reinstalled Win11 and it just won't recognize the audio devices (Intel, Realtek or Nvidia), and the laptop's screen kept flickering every few seconds and I have no way to fix it even if I downloaded and installed Intel Iris and Nvidia MX250 newest drivers.

The screen flickering problem happened about half year ago while I was still using Win10, it forced me upgrade to Win11 and screen flickering problem go away . But now the newly reinstalled Win11 doesn't even have sound?

Enough is enough. I don't play games so I made the decision to give LMDE 6 a spin. For a day, so far so good, even VMware works! Except wifi drivers for two TP-Link adapters.

Linux Mint is based on Ubuntu. LMDE 6 is based on Debian, yet use the same Cinnamon desktop.

 

[mikeymikec]

Seriously wondering what I'm going to do when Win10 goes out of support (apparently October next year). No more security updates, I hear. So won't be able to put the main PC on-line at all (it's not good enough to upgrade to 11, apparently, would have to get a new CPU and motherboard, so a complete rebuild).

Maybe will just use the (even) older PC with Linux for everything internet and keep the win10 box as is for strictly-off-line gaming?

Will be a problem for Steam games and podcast downloading. Maybe eventually migrate everything to Linux? Really resenting the effort it's all going to take.

Or use Microsoft's official workaround guidelines to install Win11 on not-officially-supported hardware and then do an upgrade install with the latest version every couple of years?

 

[Indus]

During the weekend my Intel 10th gen laptop's Win11 just screwed up. Somehow it suddenly won't open any VMware VM and said it's either invalid format or there was internal error. I then reinstalled Win11 and it just won't recognize the audio devices (Intel, Realtek or Nvidia), and the laptop's screen kept flickering every few seconds and I have no way to fix it even if I downloaded and installed Intel Iris and Nvidia MX250 newest drivers.

The screen flickering problem happened about half year ago while I was still using Win10, it forced me upgrade to Win11 and screen flickering problem go away . But now the newly reinstalled Win11 doesn't even have sound?

Enough is enough. I don't play games so I made the decision to give LMDE 6 a spin. For a day, so far so good, even VMware works! Except wifi drivers for two TP-Link adapters.

Linux Mint is based on Ubuntu. LMDE 6 is based on Debian, yet use the same Cinnamon desktop.

My wifi adapter died and I bought the TP-Link one from amazon. Works and I didn't even have to install drivers.

BTW don't experiment with Wayland.. some people may say it's better but it's also buggy.. stick with the Xorg11 default that LM and LMDE comes with.

 

[manly]

Or use Microsoft's official workaround guidelines to install Win11 on not-officially-supported hardware and then do an upgrade install with the latest version every couple of years?

It's 2024. When we were younger, we were still okay with this level of effort to use and "enjoy" computing. Nowadays, the expectation is a turnkey experience, not jumping through arbitrary and time-consuming hoops.

As an aside Windows XP had extended updates for the POSReady edition, which regular consumers could take advantage of with simple registry tweaks. I haven't checked, but can you get Win10 updates by faking the LTSC or IoT edition? IoT is supported until 2032 IIRC.

 

[mikeymikec]

It's 2024. When we were younger, we were still okay with this level of effort to use and "enjoy" computing. Nowadays, the expectation is a turnkey experience, not jumping through arbitrary and time-consuming hoops.

As an aside Windows XP had extended updates for the POSReady edition, which regular consumers could take advantage of with simple registry tweaks. I haven't checked, but can you get Win10 updates by faking the LTSC or IoT edition? IoT is supported until 2032 IIRC.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean, but I'll answer your last question: MS is offering 3 years of extended support on Win10 at a rate of $60 for the first year, $120 for the second year and $240 for the third year. I doubt that LTSC or any other edition will work around that because MS wants the $$$.

The official workaround for Win11 is really easy: Download a Win11 ISO, use Rufus to burn it to USB and tick the options that you want (including the system requirements workaround). Install Windows with said USB stick. End of story. For the upgrade install 2 years later, rinse and repeat but do an upgrade install with it instead.

Using this technique I even upgrade-installed a Win10 install. The only complication I've encountered is that one should try to consistently use the same language edition of Windows when downloading the ISOs, otherwise the upgrade-install option won't be a straight upgrade install, more of a reset install but keeping personal files (it warns you beforehand).

I thought I'd mention it because while I took the Linux route in 2018, I wouldn't say it was the easy route, and I started migrating when I saw the writing on the wall with Win10 and jumped ship from Win7 with two years' support left so I had plenty of time to even go back to Win7 if I chose. I have a lot more experience with Windows than Linux (though I have played around with test Linux installs several times over the last ~20 years), and if I had to summarise my experience with Linux, I'd word it like this: Stuff I expected to be complicated turned out to be easy, and stuff I expected to be easy turned out to be more complicated.

 

[Triloby]

BTW don't experiment with Wayland.. some people may say it's better but it's also buggy.. stick with the Xorg11 default that LM and LMDE comes with.

If you're using Nvidia graphics on any desktop environment that's NOT the latest version of either GNOME or KDE Plasma (or one of those fancy window managers like Sway and Hyprland), then I wouldn't recommend using Wayland just yet. From what I've heard, Wayland works fine enough on Intel/AMD graphics through Mesa. But depending on the apps/clients that you use, they may not function properly on Wayland if you use features like screensharing or global hotkeys/shortcuts.

However, this issue could be fixed in the future with the explicit sync protocol being introduced in Wayland. This should hopefully eliminate the big issues plaguing Nvidia on Wayland (screen flickering and stuttering) and this feature should be available in later versions of GNOME, KDE Plasma, XWayland, and Nvidia's proprietary driver version 560.