Probably meant to ask if Wafer-on-Wafer n3 (cores only) + n4 (level 2 and 3 cache) would be a viable option for zen5c.
Definitely cheaper than n2p
N2 seems unlikely given AMD usually wait quite a while for a process to mature before they send a chip to be fabbed on it (or its AMD custom variant).We will see if Zen 6 brings any changes in how caches are organized. Since Zen 6 will be N3 or even N2, there will be more incentive to move L3 entirely off the main die.
No.We will see if Zen 6 brings any changes in how caches are organized.
Wrooooooooong they're one of the first N3e customers and N2 is theirs and theirs alone (for Venice-Dense).N2 seems unlikely given AMD usually wait quite a while for a process to mature before they send a chip to be fabbed on it
N3e is still TSMC's 2nd N3 node though.they're one of the first N3e customers
It's the first actual one since N3b came out stillborn.N3e is still TSMC's 2nd N3 node though.
Wat.they must be less concerned about tuning for absolute performance
No it's egregiously expensive but cloud guys can pay.I guess if they know that many are just skipping N2 for the BSPD feature in N2P then TSMC might give them a good price on it.
Soresu is correct once again. You used to be conservative with your theories, Joe. Have you been bitten by the brain eating mlid bug?
You'll see why next year.Lol that sounds ominous
N2 has no density bump over N3p (it's like 1.1x moar); perf/power is what cloud guys ready to pay for and they will.It would make sense to use it for product most benefiting from density, same as Zen5c is likely to be the first AMD CPU to use N3, while the mainstream lineup is going to use N4.
Maybe MRAM could help with the power issues. Or is MRAM a never-fulfilled promise?SLCs have horrible latency and power characteristics and thus are not really suitable for CPUs.
All MRAM implementations have considerably higher write power than SRAM so ughhhh...Maybe MRAM could help with the power issues.
Not any time soon.when AMD will be going big.LITTLE on desktop CPUs
Doesn't look like you're getting dense spam in DT any time soon and there's not really a reason to.Will it be introduced on Zen5/6/7/...?
And Zen4C and the like I would not call little, its just less cache, same core. So I doubt they will go big.little, but dying to hear what adroc_thurston has to say,@adroc_thurston:
What are your thoughts with regards to when AMD will be going big.LITTLE on desktop CPUs? Will it be introduced on Zen5/6/7/...?
They will, in mobile.So I doubt they will go big.little
Yea Intel big cores are pretty bad at the whole area efficient nT shtick.Intel had to do that to save power and still do something close to competitive
I'm sorta confident Zen5 will change their opinion on that.but at some point consumers will want more cores too
Well, I am the exception to that rule. I can't have enough BIG fast cores. 9554 Genoa is pretty good, but I still want more.I'm sorta confident Zen5 will change their opinion on that.
And Zen4C and the like I would not call little, its just less cache, same core. So I doubt they will go big.little, but dying to hear what adroc_thurston has to say,
Edit: and I agree. Intel had to do that to save power and still do something close to competitive. But I don't think it is. Zen4 is better than a P-core and I have 16-96 of them depending on the box.
Some buyers, even gamers, play the 'spec' game very loosely (wow, moar cores!). Enthusiasts, like here, run the numbers and largely ignore stupid marketing slides.I'm sorta confident Zen5 will change their opinion on that.
Why do you keep bringing this up?BTW, there was some discussion about using Zen5c in AM5 socket.
What do you think server CPUs based on Z4c are for?AMD has bee outright negligent about not pursuing the low budget server market, given an overwhelming advantage Zen 4 already has (while Intel is probably outselling AM5 servers 100:1)
They are for (they sell for) multiple thousands of dollars in 128 core Bergamo. That's quite high end of the server market.Why do you keep bringing this up?
What do you think server CPUs based on Z4c are for?
Siena is for that.AMD has bee outright negligent about not pursuing the low budget server market
Don't worry, AMD's 1st party bar charts will be nice and juicy too.Some buyers, even gamers, play the 'spec' game very loosely (wow, moar cores!).
I think Siena is positioned a lot higher than that. Low end servers are way below $2,000 price even below $1,000 for the whole server.Siena is for that.
Don't worry, AMD's 1st party bar charts will be nice and juicy too.
Lower-end SKUs no, and it will be more interesting with Sorano, too.I think Siena is positioned a lot higher than that.
Beyond niche market.Low end servers are way below $2,000 price even below $1,000 for the whole server.