Discussion Baldur's Gate 3

[RPD]

This is my first CRPG and I'm having a blast.

Did you know Gale gains 'Sculpt Spells' subclass feature at level 2 which allows him to totally ignore party damage? You can nuke your own party with the fireball, only enemies will get hurt.

After a lot of learning, I'm finally in a nice groove.

1. My pally hits like a truck with his divine smite.
2. Gale's hurling fireballs at everyone - 1 shot kill at start.
3. The Gith girl is two handing a Gith weapon which deals a massive damage and she takes 4 swings in a single turn (Double action + extra attack per turn)
4. I had Karlach doing Frenzy and doing damage, but honestly not as good as Gith. I swapped her out for Shadowheart.
5. I respec'd the subclass of Shadowheart from Trickster to Life Domain. Now she has tons of party heals.

I'm now considering to up the difficulty to Tactician. Enemies die just too quickly.

Also I have a question on the attack formula. If my Shadowheart is casting a spell that says a DEX save, do I have below right?

Spell Difficulty Class (base 8) + Proficiency 3 + Ability modifier of WIS 3 = 16
The enemy must do a Saving Throw of 16 or more. So he will be Die throw + DEX modifier of enemy 3

Is that right? Where does my proficiency come from? Is it the quarterstaff weapon?

Reminds me first year in college in the dorms.. 1999, I saw a soon to be a still friend playing the OG BG. I was like W.T.F. is this real time, yet turned based magical RPG game you are playing?? I had never seen ANYTHING like it before.

 

[hardhat]

For spell to hit and DC... it gets complicated.
There is a 'to hit' effect for some spells. This is your chance to hit the target with a projectile and do damage. Some spells auto hit, like magic missile or the spells that give you a radius effect. An example of a spells that needs to roll to hit would be a firebolt cantrip. Those spells have you roll an attack against the enemy's armor class using your bonuses to hit for spells. Here are the relevant considerations for those abilities:
1. 1d20 for to hit base, plus
2. Bonuses from effects on your character, such as 'bless' adding a 1d4 (or 2d4) to hit chance.
3. Bonus for your character's proficiency. All player characters start with a +2 proficiency score, get to +3 at level 5, and then to +4 at level 9.
4. Bonus for your spellcasting proficiency bonus. If you are a wizard casting the spell your would use your intelligence bonus, which is calculated as (Intelligence / 2) - 5, rounded down. So if you have 12 int you get +1, 16 int +3, etc.
5. Bonuses or penalties for to hit advantage (sleeping target, held target, stunned target, casting from outside range, casting from below, casting from above, gain advantage or disadvantage from many many other sources).



For spellcasting DC (difficulty class) you are using your value against what the enemy rolls to determine if they can avoid damage, or overcome an effect.
Your spellcasting DC base is 8 + proficiency bonus + spellcasting proficiency bonus (dependent on which stat you used to cast the spell), and may also get some other bonuses from items or effects.
The proficiency bonus is dependent on level, as explained above.
The spellcasting proficiency bonus is also calculated as above.


Your opponent is trying to roll to overcome your spell save DC. The spell will tell you which stat the enemy is rolling with (dex save, wis save, etc.) and the enemy is rolling a d20

So if you are a level 6 warlock and your opponent is trying to avoid damage from your fireball (dex save for half damage), you have 20 charisma, and your opponent has 12 dexterity, here is what the calculation looks like.
Your spell DC is 8(base) + 3 (level based proficiency bonus) + 5 (charisma spellcasting bonus) = 16.

Your opponent will roll a D20 and get his saving throw bonus from dexterity (same formula as spellcasting proficiency bonus) of +1, and if he is proficient in dexterity saving throws he will add his level based proficiency total to his roll as well, plus any items/effects/etc that may effect him.
Let's say he is proficient in dexterity saving throws. He is also level 6, so he gets +3 based on level.

Your opponent will roll D20 +1 (dex bonus) + 3 (level based proficiency bonus), and has to beat or tie your 16 to reduce the damage.


This can make magical items that give you proficiency in saving throws very valuable. It can also make magical items that give a bonus to your spell DC temporarily or permanently extremely powerful. I have a hat that increases my spellcasting DC by two each time I inflict damage with a fire spell. So I can cast scorching ray, which lets me target three enemies separately for a ray of fire damage, and get a +6 spellcasting DC bonus from the hat (that decreases each turn). With my buffed up DC I can usually hold person and expect it to stick.

 

[Zeze]

Your spell DC is 8(base) + 3 (level based proficiency bonus) + 5 (charisma spellcasting bonus) = 16.

Thanks, where is the proficiency coming from - the staff I'm using?

I can cast spells without the staff right and the only thing I'd lose is +3 proficiency right?

 

[hardhat]

The proficiency bonus is based on your level. Characters level 1-4 have a proficiency bonus of +2. Characters level 5-8 get +3, Characters level 9-12 get +4.

You don't need to use a staff to cast spells. You can use any weapon you want-even dual wield or use a shield. But you need proficiency in the armor you are wearing to cast spells while wearing it. Most caster classes only have light armor proficiency, but you can also get armor proficiencies from your race as well. This applies for ALL armor slots, not just the torso armor. No spellcasting in a heavy armor helm if you aren't proficient in heavy armor.

 

[Zeze]

Thanks. I also learned that the game fails to make it clear that all spells you cast you are already proficient in it.

 

[aigomorla]

Too busy playing the different routes to write accurate comment....
This is also probably the one game where you want to try the evil route before you shelf it.

 

[Zeze]

The game got rather easy after getting comfortable with the mechanics. So I upped the difficulty to tactician.

Well my first fight, the enemy dude confused my full hp gale, then pushed him into chasm for an instant death. Fun times.

Tactician is still fun.

 

[DigDog]

Speedrun in 4 minutes.

explanation on the strat

 

[Rigg]

I picked this game up recently and I'm totally digging it. It's very immersive with excellent voice acting. It does a great job of capturing the old Bioware RPG vibe. The game mostly looks great and runs very smooth. I've been playing it on Linux with vulcan and it runs great. I never played the previous Baldur's gate installments but did play the hell out of the KOTOR games.

It took me a while to get a hang of the combat but I'm pretty comfortable now. I'm mostly a living room TV gamer so I'm preferring the controller experience over keyboard and mouse so far. I might give keyboard and mouse another shot and see if I can get more comfortable with it though. I find camera and character movement with the controller preferable but combat control is a bit clunky with the radial controls.

I'm not super well versed in D&D combat systems but I have a good familiarity with the basics from playing a lot of the KOTOR games back in the day. Magic seems a bit complicated/overwhelming so far and I haven't completely wrapped my head around that aspect just yet. I've been playing around with character builds a bit after doing some homework on the wiki. The ability to re-spec yourself and/or party members in exchange for gold is a great feature IMO.

I have to say that I'm finding the 2 weapon fighting mechanics extremely frustrating though. IMO It's really dumb that the offhand attack costs a bonus action for 2 weapon fighting but not for two hand weapons. Using 2 melee weapons is practically useless without the 2 weapon fighting class feature that applies your attack and damage bonus to the off-hand attacks. Since this class feature is only available for Fighter, Ranger, & College of Swords (and doesn't suit any of those classes particularly well since they only get one bonus action) it's usefulness strikes me as extremely limited. I'm struggling to imagine a scenario where it wouldn't be massively preferable to spec any of those 3 classes for two handed weapons instead. Other than taking one or two levels of fighter (to get 2 weapon fighting class feature ) and then switching over to rouge with the thief sub class (to get 2 bonus actions to effectively use 2 melee weapons) I don't see how this makes any sense to use. With a level 1 fighter/ level 11 rouge hybrid you are effectively just trading your level 12 feat for 2 weapon fighting so not a huge deal. Since you can't melee sneak attack with non-finesse weapons it makes some sense for rouges. It seems like a pretty big oversight to not have 2 weapon fighting available as a class feature for rouges though. They could have at least made the ability available via a feat.

 

[hardhat]

Yes, two weapon fighting doesn't really make much sense because bonus actions are very limited. Except for rogue. Rogue basically adds diversity to your party as they can do things like open chests that fighters can't. They also get specialization bonuses.

I ended up making Astorian into a champion 6/thief 5/warlock (GOO) 1 because I wanted more DPS than rogue could put out, but still valued some of the rogue specialties and didn't want to completely reclass him. Warlock 1 gets him mortal reminder, so his crit sneak attacks fear enemies. And I chose champion for more crit opportunity combined with the two offhand attacks from thief. He can't compete once fighters with three attacks per action, but is good enough considering the extras he brings to the party.

 

[Heartbreaker]

I have to say that I'm finding the 2 weapon fighting mechanics extremely frustrating though. IMO It's really dumb that the offhand attack costs a bonus action for 2 weapon fighting but not for two hand weapons. Using 2 melee weapons is practically useless without the 2 weapon fighting class feature that applies your attack and damage bonus to the off-hand attacks. Since this class feature is only available for Fighter, Ranger, & College of Swords (and doesn't suit any of those classes particularly well since they only get one bonus action) it's usefulness strikes me as extremely limited. I'm struggling to imagine a scenario where it wouldn't be massively preferable to spec any of those 3 classes for two handed weapons instead. Other than taking one or two levels of fighter (to get 2 weapon fighting class feature ) and then switching over to rouge with the thief sub class (to get 2 bonus actions to effectively use 2 melee weapons) I don't see how this makes any sense to use. With a level 1 fighter/ level 11 rouge hybrid you are effectively just trading your level 12 feat for 2 weapon fighting so not a huge deal. Since you can't melee sneak attack with non-finesse weapons it makes some sense for rouges. It seems like a pretty big oversight to not have 2 weapon fighting available as a class feature for rouges though. They could have at least made the ability available via a feat.

I don't have the game, but read about this. Two weapon fighting definitely seems on the blah end of the spectrum, and from what I read, only one attack per turn qualifies as a sneak attack. It definitely makes Rogues weaker in combat, than older versions of DnD like 3.5e.

 

[Rigg]

I don't have the game, but read about this. Two weapon fighting definitely seems on the blah end of the spectrum, and from what I read, only one attack per turn qualifies as a sneak attack. It definitely makes Rogues weaker in combat, than older versions of DnD like 3.5e.

Yeah I can confirm only 1 sneak attack per turn. It reduces their damage per turn for sure but it's still a pretty strong class. You can basically solo just about anything with a rogue though it's pretty cheese. You can sneak into a good hiding place in bow range before attacking, do your sneak attack, hide, end turn, rinse, and repeat. The bad guys probably won't be able to spot and attack you and it just cycles back to your turn so you can repeatedly sneak attack and hide again. You'll likely need to maneuver to engage multiple targets and risk getting spotted after initiating combat though. if they do spot you, you can always dash away and hide or even leave combat. Then you can just start the cycle again. You have a ton of movement potential with a thief because of the 2nd bonus action if you need it. You can do 3 dashes (or a disengage and 2 dashes) to run leave combat if need be.

 

[WelshBloke]

I don't have the game, but read about this. Two weapon fighting definitely seems on the blah end of the spectrum, and from what I read, only one attack per turn qualifies as a sneak attack. It definitely makes Rogues weaker in combat, than older versions of DnD like 3.5e.

TBH having more than one sneak attack in a round is weird.

*STAB* "OUCH! What was that?!"
*STAB* "OUCH! What was that?!"
*STAB* "OUCH! What was that?!"

 

[Rigg]

Yes, two weapon fighting doesn't really make much sense because bonus actions are very limited. Except for rogue. Rogue basically adds diversity to your party as they can do things like open chests that fighters can't. They also get specialization bonuses.

I ended up making Astorian into a champion 6/thief 5/warlock (GOO) 1 because I wanted more DPS than rogue could put out, but still valued some of the rogue specialties and didn't want to completely reclass him. Warlock 1 gets him mortal reminder, so his crit sneak attacks fear enemies. And I chose champion for more crit opportunity combined with the two offhand attacks from thief. He can't compete once fighters with three attacks per action, but is good enough considering the extras he brings to the party.

After looking over it again I'm not sure it's all that viable for a rogue either. It ultimately comes down to gear. You need two weapon fighting and dual wielder to outpace dual single hand xbows which get the off hand dex bonus out of the box. That eats 2 feats minimum depending on how you multi-class. I'm running a thieving monk character right now and it seems like a pretty sweet combo. I use a combo of a single finesse weapon, dual xbows, and unarmed attacks. I'm only Lv3 rouge and Lv2 monk currently. At Lv5 monk I'll get an extra attack although I'll sacrifice 2d6 of sneak attack damage by max level. Seems worth the trade off on paper for the extra attack and other monk goodies.

 

[Zeze]

I've been playing this a lot. This is my first CRPG. After getting the hang of it, I posted some feedback and nerds on reddit seem to agree.

1. Am playing tactician difficulty with no multiclasses (too lazy, level up linear per subclasses)

2. Lae'zel hits like a mofo truck. With action surge and figher feats, she eats everyone's skills then gets right in your face and kills them all. I'm a heavy armor wearing Paladin that also hits like a truck with Divine Smite. But I need mana. Lae'zel doesn't. As long as she's healed, she needs nothing else. This is so good, I can't even swap out Lae'zel.

3. I changed the subclass of Shadowheart (Cleric) from Trickster to Life Domain. This comes with many party heals finally. She's mostly healing and buffing at every turn so that melee can do their thing. I wonder how other beginners handle this lack of healing since changing her subclass is not a beginner thing to do.

4. Gale has his place. I don't like his character much, but I have to keep a pure DPS spellcaster while my Paladin & Life Domain cast support skills. Gale has his moments with Fireball, Firewall, Lightning, & Mass Confusion. You can stack up the Cull of the Weak worm power and have his AOE spells do more damage. During a large invasion, my Gale's single fireball completely wiped out FIVE monsters with 30-40 hp. It was so satisfying, I think I kept a separate Save file for this.

5. Shadow Heart can help with 'Turn Undead' which also deals AOE damage if you're SH.

No rogues on my team. I can't stand that greasy Astarion and I killed him when he tried that thing while I was asleep. I re-loaded the save and kept him just for his dumb story. My main Paladin handles the dialogue with high charisma. Lae'zel handles all the lockpicking/disarming rather very well due to the class feat (dex advantage) + Lucky feat + Guiding hand by SH.

I'm about to go to Act 3. I'm already looking forward to my second playthrough with a rogue main (probably Thief 1-hit kill / repeat hiding mechanic) + More Karlach frenzy + Halsin Druid support.

Nerds say yea, vanilla Fighters do hit like a truck and Lae'zel is pretty OP even at tactician difficulty.

Some OP spells....

* Haste is ridiculous. I think Lae'zel attacked like 8 times in a single turn. She has this nasty subclass skill which does a whopping 30 dmg with a bonus action at anytime if she killed someone.

* Misty Step is also OP. This allows anyone to reposition from afar right into enemies or away. With this, your melee can just kill 1 or 2 right from first turn. I think all of my party members have this ready to go either via skill or item/scroll.

* Guiding Hand is too good. You already knew that.

* Always buy all potions at every vendor and refresh. Make sure everyone has them in their inventory. They're cheap and only cost bonus action. You can also throw them too.

 

[sze5003]

Can you change the subclass of shadowheart at any time?

All my characters are level 4 now and I'm about to go do the Auntie Ethel quest in Act 1 when I get back home.

I didn't see an option to change her to be more of a party healer because that would be helpful. I'm a warlock with pact of the blade using the sword I got from the demon guy off the nautilus.

I keep astarion around because he has magic missile and I dont mind gale but I usually don't take him along because I keep having to feed him magic items.

 

[Zeze]

Can you change the subclass of shadowheart at any time?

All my characters are level 4 now and I'm about to go do the Auntie Ethel quest in Act 1 when I get back home.

I didn't see an option to change her to be more of a party healer because that would be helpful. I'm a warlock with pact of the blade using the sword I got from the demon guy off the nautilus.

I keep astarion around because he has magic missile and I dont mind gale but I usually don't take him along because I keep having to feed him magic items.

Go to that zombie dude at camp who can reset your class for a small gold.

Life Domain gives you like 2 AOE heals with massive healing and huge range. Why is she a trickster by default for everyone?

2 to 3 heroes down? Just have SH cast 1 AOE heal. Everyone is up with 50% hp. This saves like 5 turns lmao. SH feels like a classic healer of Final fantasy JRPGs.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Why is she a trickster by default for everyone?

Because she serves an Evil god who's domains are Death and Trickery.

 

[Zeze]

Go to that zombie dude at camp who can reset your class for a small gold.

Life Domain gives you like 2 AOE heals with massive healing and huge range. Why is she a trickster by default for everyone?

2 to 3 heroes down? Just have SH cast 1 AOE heal. Everyone is up with 50% hp. This saves like 5 turns lmao. SH feels like a classic healer of Final fantasy JRPGs.

If you haven't found him, he's at the first dungeon northeast.

 

[sze5003]

I do have the skeleton dude at the camp. I never respecced anyone so I'll have to check Shadowheart and see what she is set up with by default.

I think I do have one AOE healing spell set with her but I've never been able to use it. Perhaps it can only be used after a long rest.

 

[Zeze]

I do have the skeleton dude at the camp. I never respecced anyone so I'll have to check Shadowheart and see what she is set up with by default.

I think I do have one AOE healing spell set with her but I've never been able to use it. Perhaps it can only be used after a long rest.

Enjoy.

https://baldursgate3.wiki.fextralife.com/Life+Domain

BG3 CLERIC LIFE DOMAIN PROGRESSION​

• Level 1 - Domain Spells (Bless, Cure Wounds)
• Level 1 - Disciple of Life (Subclass Feature)
• Level 1 - Heavy Armour Proficiency (Subclass Feature)
• Level 2 - Preserve Life (Action)
• Level 3 - Domain Spells (Lesser Restoration, Aid)
• Level 5 - Domain Spells (Revivify, Beacon of Hope)
• Level 6 - Blessed Healer (Subclass Feature)
• Level 7 - Domain Spells (Death Ward, Guardian of Faith)
• Level 8 - Divine Strike: Life (Action)
• Level 9 - Domain Spells (Mass Cure Wounds, Greater Restoration)

That Preserve Life at Level 2 is utterly insane, esp with the Discipline of Life passive (heal self when healing others). It uses your Channel Divinity points, this means you can use this healing on top of your existing Cleric AOE healing that consumes mana/spell slot.

 

[sze5003]

Thanks a lot! Yea I definitely didn't have her specced out like that, no wonder I was always struggling in higher level areas because she couldn't heal us all the time.

 

[Zeze]

It's official, tactician is easy once you get the hang of the game. It looks like lots of nerds online have the same sentiment.

Haste is indeed op.

I was fighting a major boss. My main Paladin was down and received a minor heal. He needed much more healing so he doesn't die again. Well, I had a brainfart and hasted him stead of healing. Well.... the 12hp Paladin ended up smacking the boss with FOUR Divine Smites. That's about 30-40 disgusting damage per smitin'. I think one of them critted too. The boss just straight up died from half hp.

Also before another fight, I actually used my brain and pre-hasted two of my fighters + blessed all so they don't break the concentration. Then the battle started. Well.... I forgot Haste also incredibly boosts your movement. In a single turn, Lae'zel went insane on a warpath.

1. Runs straight across the room to insta-kill a brute in 2 hits with a crit.
2. Runs to another, smack another two times. The second brute is barely hanging onto his life.
3. That was just haste. Now time for Action Surge.
4. Smack twice again. That's right, I've swung 6 times now.
5. Lae'zel has this crazy 25-35 dmg attack as a bonus action after you kill someone. That is just too much.

She's just level 8. lmao. She needs no magic.

Body count 3 - the battle is 90% over in a single turn of Lae'zel.

And even without Haste, it's exp scales much faster than enemies. I could use a Tactician Plus mode.

 

[Zeze]

Thanks a lot! Yea I definitely didn't have her specced out like that, no wonder I was always struggling in higher level areas because she couldn't heal us all the time.

I'm new to the game as well. I seriously wonder why Shadow Heart defaults to Trickster domain. How do all players deal with this lack of healing? Healing is so hard to come by until you simply change the subclass of SH.

 

[Rigg]

I also changed Shadowheart over to life domain and fixed up her attributes. I see I'm not the only one who thought this was a logical decision. I just discovered haste was a thing the other day. I'm less inclined to call haste overpowered and more inclined to call Lae'zel overpowered. I think the fighter class in general is a bit unbalanced. There are just too many high damage attacks per turn available vs most of the other classes. Haste just exacerbates the problem since the total number of attacks availible in a single turn makes the tradeoff of sitting out the next turn pretty irrelevant.